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By WheresMyRepParty - Posted on 18 February 2009

I support free-speech and I have no problem with extreme views getting airtime.  Sometimes I believe it is beneficial to get even the most extreme opinions out on the table.  Ultimately I expect reason to prevail and only the most closed-minded will hang onto their extreme views.

That said, I don't know how I feel about this article from Newsweek:

"A member of the Dutch Parliament who was banned last week from entering the United Kingdom because of his inflammatory anti-Islamic views is about to be welcomed to the United States by some notable conservatives."

Now, I can understand that there may be a worthy debate about some of the extremist views found in all religions.  I can even understand the need for debate about concerns over certains aspects of specific religions.  But how do these conservatives honestly think this would appear? 

This person doesn't seem to be anything more than another extreme blowhard.  My first response was to view this as necessary in the overall debate, but then I actually thought about it.  Will the debate include discussions on other religions?  For instance, will there be anyone there that will argue that Christianity is a violent religion?  Surely there enough evidence in the Bible, just take Joshua's extermination of the men, women, and children of Jericho.  You can't really have a discussion of what Islam teaches and its association with terrorism without accounting for similar teachings and stories in other religions.  If this person can argue that Islam teaches terrorism, then he has to acknowledge the Bible's teachings of the Isrealites conquest of Canaan and somehow convince us that it is somehow more righteous.

I don't believe any of the major religion can be considered tolerant if one adheres to a literal translation of their teachings.  It is just a shame that the Republican party may continue to support this brand of conservatism and prey on the intolerance of some in the party.



Surely there enough evidence in the Bible, just take Joshua's extermination of the men, women, and children of Jericho.

Um - arguably that would be the Jewish religion, not the Christian.  Wasn't the new testament supposed to supplant the old? Depends on the branch you practice I guess.

I don't believe any of the major religion can be considered tolerant if one adheres to a literal translation of their teachings.

Sadly I agree with this. Though I find that I must define myself as an athiest, it is the only aspect of religion that I have a problem with, and that truly frightens me.



Wasn't the new testament supposed to supplant the old?

Not by the text of the New Testament itself, if memory serves. Of course, the "all Scripture" thing can be up to interpretation.


It's sad that we've reached a point where 'government service' is a dirty word... If we're the greatest country on earth, maybe we can have the greatest government.

Lewis Black

Sorry, I wasn't actually trying to argue any position or teaching of a particular faith.  I was mostly focused on the reasons a certain branch of conservatism would think welcoming a person like Wilders would be a good idea for the image of the Republican party. 

Wasn't the new testament supposed to supplant the old?

Christians believe that Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of the Old Testament. Christians are not under the laws of the Old Testament but under the laws of Christ. 

Romans 10:4  Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. 

But Brandon, while I think you are far above most conservatives in practicing the proper mix of following the example and teachings of Christ which were to fulfill the ot laws and expand beyond mere legalism by practicing love, I think the vast majority of fundies are way more caught up in legalism than that.


To consider any combination of the terms conservatives, Christians and fundies to be automatically one and the same is erroneous.  The far right fundies are in a class by themselves, and should be labeled as such. Unfortunately, they are the most vocal, and therefore get the most press, even though they are the minority of Christians and conservatives.

Unfortunately you are right lephead, but where the fundies are hypocritical is that they pick and choose what Old Testament laws they think must be obeyed. 

In Leviticus, it says one should not wear clothes that are a mix of wool and linen.  I doubt if too many follow that one.  It also says that whenever a woman has her period, she becomes impure and any place she sits or lies becomes impure for 7 days.  Leviticus also states that adulterers should be stoned to death.

There are many rules in the Old Testament that are a good model to live by such as the Ten Commandments.  But most of the Old Testament law was for the purpose of making the Jewish people distinct from other groups of the era.


Frank Gaffney, whom the article says is responsible for bringing Wilders to these shores, is also the idiot behind the promotion of two "fake terrorists", Walid Shoebat and Kamal Saleem, to lecture on the evils of Islam and to evangelize to a fundamentalist Christianity at the Air Force Academy. Military Religious Freedom Foundation website has additional info as does

For Frank Gaffney and his associates in the U.S. Air Force, this is a religious war.

If you aren't familiar with the MRFF efforts, you should take a look at their website. There are stories there that will curl your toes.

This brings to light something i've been aware of awhile. Muslims are gaining more and more political power in Europe. Like this guy or not, being banned because of your views of islam is not a good road to go down. They are also in the early stages of allowing Sharia law in Britian and banning of anti-religous free speech in the Netherlands. Just like with the US, the extremist are the most vocal and are behind these changes in Europe.

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