You are hereForums / Issues / Other Issues / Should We Vote Obama 08? No.
Should We Vote Obama 08? No.
I don't think that Senator Obama truly understands what his faith means. Any well-read Christian will point out that if the senator believes that abortion is wrong, he would come down on the pro-life side. Any political strategist will point out that he's straddling the center here.
Pilate's story can give us some guidance here, because he was in a comparable situation. We know that he was just as guilty as the men who crucified Jesus Christ; he couldn't wash his hands of that even in his reasoning to avert a riot. There's no gray area.
There's no gray area in cooking intelligence books either, but Republicans should also be aware that none of the Republican contenders started this war. If they voted for it, the Democrats voted for it at their side. But, they all voted on flawed intelligence. What the Republicans understand is that we are in the war right now. We're past debating whether it was a mistake because that debate wont take us anywhere.
Republicans and Democrats want to get out of Iraq, but Republicans understand that the way out is going to be more difficult than simply calling for a withdrawal.
Don't get me wrong, issues are very important to this voter. But, let's be honest, none of the current crop of candidates are going to, or can overturn Roe v. Wade. If you feel that strongly, you need to be activist about supporting socially conservative legislators.
Personally, I'm simply putting issues and differences aside this election cycle to vote for a candidate who is inspiring, and who, I believe, can heal some of the fresh wounds of this nation.
Obama in '08!
Hey! News flash for you: NOT ALL REPUBLICANS ARE RIGHT-WING CHRISTAINS!!!!! As a moderate and a Jew, I must say that George Bush has done MORE to turn me away from the Republican Party than even the Iraq War or anything else. I absolutely and categorically RESENT how his pandering to fundamental Christians has led to him enacting Federal policies that further his own personal religious views and NOT the best interests of the country as a whole.
My sister may well die young of Type II (i.e., Juvenile) diabetes because of his ASSININE stem cell research policies! (Policies that also ham-string our biotech industry from global competition too, btw). For him to care more about a tiny lump of cells sitting in a freezer than the living, breathing, human beings being harmed by this policy - is obscene. My sister, for example, may well not be around to see her 2-year old daughter go to the prom someday -- that's beyond obscene. As for abortion - that's simple: If you're against it - DON'T HAVE ONE! And, ADOPT a kid too, while you're at it.
Since WHEN was the U.S. Government supposed to be legislating morality? And, who appointed HIM as the arbiter of that morality? In the past I've stayed voting for Republicans because I agree with their fiscal policies and anti-big government positions. But, with Bush running up the deficit, letting oil get to $100 a barrel, etc. etc. etc., combined with these destructive quasi-theocratic domestic policies, there's absolutely NO reason for me to support the GOP any more.
The funniest part of all is that now the "Neo-Cons" (Rush Limbaugh, as a prime example) have been turning on John McCain for not being conservative ENOUGH. Well, DUH!!!! He ISN'T as conservative as Bush or Romney, and - guess what, Rush! - He's been beating Romney up and down the country! And, THERE'S A REASON FOR THIS! The vast moderate middle of America is FINALLY waking up to the stench of 20 years of dynastic Party-run government (a la Clintons, Bushes) and realizing they have NOT been good for our country. There's a REASON Obama and McCain are out front. America is FED UP with the same-old politics of entitlement and have HAD ENOUGH. Please, please God for a November ballot without a Bush or a Clinton on it - FINALLY!
Phew! Thanks for listening as I got that of my chest.....
I am not a voting Republican (read Democrat -- soon to beome at least an Indepent thinker). I joined RepublicansForObama.org because I really wanted to know if Republicans could really be for Mr. Obama. I AM VERY IMPRESSED!!!
I agree with both Obama's and your position on abortion. While I don't agree with abortion, I am in agreement that there are other equally important issues. I hope that I am correct in assuming that this group's position that we don't have the right to take another life. We can also speak against taking a life (abortion), WITHOUT ALIENATING OTHERS in the discussion.
I understand that is Mr. Obama's position. There are other equally important issues that can only be dealt with if WE DON'T ALIENATE others.
The strategies that Mr. Obama proposes with regard to Pro-Chose will go a long way to decrease the number of abortions.
I like Mr. Obama's positions on INCLUSIVENESS.
Thanks to all of you for supporting Mr. Obama!!!
Hi, Bill,
Regarding your question, this group doesn't really take positions on certain issues. We come together to discuss and support Obama's quest to win the Democratic nomination. I would say that nearly all the posters here are pro-life voters, though many don't feel that one issue is enough to determine which candidate to support.
You can see our official statement in support of Obama here.
I am impressed as well.. Impressed that there are this many delusional people in existence. If the folks on here really think they are Republicans... then they should wake up and realize that they are liberals. Stop polluting the party of small government and just start calling yourselves what you really are... big government liberals.
The party of small government ceded it's own principals to the neocons and their anti-abortion and anti gay marriage messages. There are absolutely no traces left of a small government, fiscal responsibility, state's rights..etc. The Pillars of MY GOP have been ignored in favor of these social issues which are on one side settled law and on the other case not any of anyone's business, certainly not government.
While Obama spends his time in office we can have a chance to clean this cancer out of our own party and get our ideals back on the agenda. Until then, I will support Obama where I agree with him, and will concentrate my efforts more to trying to get the GOP abck to its core.
Several issues:
1. Bush is not the Republican party
2. The ideals of the Republican party are not encompassed by the folks in Washington.
3. You don't fix the Republican party by electing the most liberal senator in the united states.
4. The war in Iraq is on the downward slope, it's not a big issue right now... thank god. We can end this war by doing what's right... restoring order in the country. The most irrational thing we could do right now is cut and run... thereby causing irreversible harm to a potential ally.
5. GWB is NOT raring to go to war with Iran... if he wanted to he could have found reason by now.
6. An unborn child is not part of their mother's bodies. The mother shouldn't have the right to kill a sentient life.
You're right. It's not about GWB. It's about McCain and his proposals vs Obama and his. If you choose to support McCain, you certainly have that right.
1. True...He is an evangelical right wing neocon with no grasp of true Republican issues.
2. True...The Republican ideals are not being represented anywhere these days, at least not on the national stage.
3. True and False...I am voting to elect the best candidate for the country, he just happens to be a liberal democrat. During his term I really hope we can work to restore our own party. It will take all Republicans to stand up and see that the GOP should no longer be the mouth piece for the religious right and the abortion/gay thing they are so hung up on.
4. False...If you believe that the Iraq war is "on the downward slope" you are delusional. The Iraqi government is no closer to unity than it was a year ago. We have heard this claim that "6 months from now __________" (fill in the blank with any of many different 6 months and all will be better promises that have been made by this administration and have been echoed and endorsed by McCain.
5. False...GWB is at every turn looking for reasons to expand our presence in the middle east. If he could find any support anywhere he would already be talking about a new shock and awe campaign.
6. I will not argue the abortion issue with anyone as I think that this single issue has no good resolution and is now nothing more than a wedge dividing the country and producing nothing but hate and anger on both sides of it. Give it a rest, the country has been focused on this one issue for almost forty years.
Regardless of all of that, I am voting for Obama because I think he is the most qualified candidate to lead us out of the divisiveness of the past. When the race is over, I will throw my hand in to help out where I can and I hope that many or most of those who support him now will answer his call and get involved.
I have not in my life ever voted for a democrat for national office and until yesterday I had never monetarily supported any democrat for any office. Tomorrow I am going to cast an early vote here in the Lone Star state and it will be proudly cast for Barack Obama.
Hi, Cat,
I'm hoping that the cataclysmic failure of the Romney campaign is an indication that the necon hold over the party is finally coming to an end.
It does bother me to see that McCain is aligning himself more and more with neocon policies, though. What happened to the maverick?
Moderate to you = Liberal to me. This little rant here is nothing but liberal propaganda.
Please find me the research that shows that emryonic stem cell research has a cure for diabetes on the way... oh that's right - there are no cures based on embryonic stem cell research.
The liberal position on this issue is OBSCENE :)
Wow are you out of touch
They now have the ability to change adult human skin cells into stem cells indistinguishable from embryonic stem cells. So the debate on this is pretty much dead....do some research before you toss your outdated opinions around.
WTF are you talking about. You just made my point dimwit.
There is NO REASON TO USE EMBRYONIC STEM CELLS.
Who's the one out of touch.
How about you read what is written before responding... your response has nothing to do with what I wrote.
Thanks Aaron,
My response was to the poster that said that GWB's position on stem cells was going to kill his daughter. GWB is only partly against EMBRYONIC stem cell research. NO ONE is opposed to adult stem cell research... and ONLY adult stem cell research has ever shown promise.
Cat, I agree with everything you've said except, try as we'd like, Bush has nothing to do with the price oil going to over $100 a barrel, it is truly supply and demand.
As for the rest of it, you get him, that's exactly what I'm upset about the religious right taking over our party. I tell you this, if I were president, any religious organization that got involved in politics in this country would lose their tax exempt status.
rel
NYC
Who is the fool? That would be anyone that calls others the name "foolish". Especially regarding something like Abortion. If it can be made legal, then it can just as easily be made illegal again.
Then why hasn't it been done yet, Chris? There haven't even been significant restrictions made. We had a GOP Congress and a GOP prez combined with a conservative court. What more are you waiting for?
Barbara - do I need to inform you that we need to have enough votes on the Supreme Court to make this change?
The President and the Congress have no power to change this... only try to make restrictions... and they HAVE done that. Barb - do you not understand that change is just around the corner?
We are maybe only ONE vote from being able to overturn Roe vs Wade. Then we can let the states make their own decisions.
Just because you say so?
So I should just say... oh well?
I guess since crime will always exist... I should just learn to accept it?
No, honey, it's well known that Obama would destroy any Republican in a head-to-head, with the possible exception of McCain. Look it up. Clinton is considered very unelectable, even many of her supporters know it. Last year a poll showed fifty percent of Americans admitted they would never vote for Hillary. That's a tough number to overcome.
There's no reason why we can't support Obama for the Democratic nomination. I suppose we could support a Republican, but if you had'nt noticed, Republicans aren't eligible for the Democratic nomination.
The truth is Hillary is the single most devisive and partisan of the 2008 field of candidates. A nomination of her as the democratic nominee would be a unifying experience...for the Bush/McCain crowd of the republican party and the Billary haters who don't like McCain enough to get out and vote, but who hate Billary enough to trudge through snow banks to vote against her if need be.
The truth is Hillary has taken more lobbyist and pac money than any other person who stood for election this time around. She reeks of back room promises, sly and slick words tailored to pander to the current person listening to her vitriol. She brings with her the slime and sludge of her husband's presidency, which in most conservative and republican circles far outweighs the former president's good accomplishments.
The truth is that those 35 years of experience she claims are mostly as a by-stander and cheerleader whose attempts at a co-presidency with her husband became a joke and her run as health care czar was a clear failure. She has six years on him as a senator, that is all. The rest of her so called experience is a shameless re-writing of history as she claims the good parts of her husband's presidency while letting the bad parts remain solely her husband's.
The truth is she claims to be advancing a femenist point of view, while her feet remain firmly planted on the shoulders of her husband's accomplishments. She would not be a nominee, a senator from New York or a political big shot but for the accomplishments of Bill Clinton.
The truth is she has run a very very poor campaign. She came in with the entire democratic machine lined up behind her, with more money and big name backers and with the best name recognition of any candidate. She squandered all of those advantages with a short sighted strategy of inevitability and an instant win and lockup of the nomination on Super Tuesday. She has completely mis-managed her campaign, whcih is telling and should make everyone wonder what that portends for her ability to manage the presidency.
The truth is Barack Obama is the best of the three remaining candidates. He offers the country a chance to reclaim our moral standing in the world and a chance to close some of the fissures we have allowed to divide our people for far too long.
First of all, I must say I'm impressed with the administrator of this site not censoring comments made against Obama. I thought for sure any comment that wasn't "pro-obama" would be censored (something a liberal would do).....so lets at least acknowledge the site admin allowing comments that do not agree with him (or her) to stand...
having said that...should we vote B. Hussein Obama in 08?
DEFINITELY NOT! In my blog I lay out a number of reasons, most prominently is that the man's positions are diametrically opposed to conservative republican views. Just because a man can speak inspirationally does NOT qualify him to be president, Does he give you goosebumps? When he speaks, do you feel as if you are transcending into Nirvanna? Then you are a sad person. ANyone who looks to a POLITICIAN to give them meaning, hope and purpose is an empty person indeed. Another man in histsory took a democracy full of decent people and spoke inspirationally to them. His words were captivating. He brought a message of CHANGE! People went crazy....young women screamed to just touch him....people felt weak in the knees as he spoke words that surely must have felt like the breath of a divine god. Change! Change! Change! And the people were swept away. They loved him so. His name was Adolph Hitler.
What a way to drop two toxic names in the same post - Hussein and Hitler. Congratulations, you know your history. But, you are completely disregarding what needs to happen in this country - you are merely using your political stance to disqualify him as president. Haven't you heard what he's been preaching? This country should not polarize any longer. We are a union, one nation under god. Don't you get that? If you're not willing to look past a campaign slogan or your predetermined prejudices, god help us and your whole party.
The fact that you left this post "anonymous" tells me another thing about you as well, you're not willing to accept your views. It's sickening to me.
"ANyone who looks to a POLITICIAN to give them meaning, hope and purpose is an empty person indeed." - I agree, politicians are not (usually) great people. But can you blame the half of america stuck in financial limbo for looking to a man who wants the same thing they want? Maybe you drive a lexus and have a nice house and a steady income- good for you. You have acheived great things. But, how can you call someone who wishes for a better life empty, when it is YOU denying them of this right to the pursuit of happiness?
saddened for the future of america,
jeremy hoffman, augustana college class of 2011
Great job Jeremy! You are much wiser than Anonymous. You prove it by at least standing in the light, not hiding in the shadows of annonymity. It is truly frightening how much anger and rage some of the people on here have toward US, who made a change from the party toward something that we believe will make the changes needed in our country. It's typical, and expected. People who have no hope want everyone as miserable as they are. I wish they could find something to be excited about.
Woo hoo, status quo! Yeah, that's not so fun!
My aunt and uncle went to Augustana in the 70's. They are doing really well right now! You have a wonderful future ahead of you! THAT'S WHY I AM VOTING OBAMA. For my 4 boys, Nathan, 22, Jordan 17, Dylan, 13 and Hunter, 6. HUNTER SAYS "ROCK A BAMA" I say Obama ROCKS!
You and the previous poster talk about change and better things... Please explain how Obama will do anything for you...
I fail to see how more government regulation and more gig government is a good thing or helpful for my economic issues.
Wow......
You just said Barack Obama was a new Hitler. You illustrated his name as B. Hussein Obama, and while that is his name, your obvious purpose is very clear.
The source of Hitler's power was in the way he demonized another race to unify those he saw as the master race.
The source of Obama's appeal is that he wants to unify us, to work with what we have in common rather than to fight over the things we dis-agree on.
You are a truly offensive person and ignorant of history. And you are anonymous.....enough said.
First of all I must say that I am less inclined to give ear to any argument submitted anonymously, which fortunately relieves any pressure to dignify said argument with a response.
Concerning abortion: I am against it. I am particularly against the odious practice of partial birth abortion. That having been said, where am I given the right to enforce my views on other Americans? The broader issue is to what extent is the government allowed to impose upon our personal lives, and more specifically, how to get people in agreement as to ways to stop it? If I am willing to agree that the government has no right to interfere with a woman's reproductive choices, she may be willing to agree that the government has no right to interfere with my home defense choices. We will all be better off when the government is no longer able to play one group against another in a slow process of subjugation.
The Uneducated Are alive & well.
So I guess you would rather have Bush in office for the next 7 years aye?
By all means, keep your heads in the sand for our country and you will wake up one day without one.
Sumrzz
Great comments. As replied earlier, I think that is what Mr. Obama believes as well. Mr. Obama is just practicing Dale Carnegie -- How To Win Friends and Influence People.
A leader without those skills are not going to take us anywhere. Mrs. Clinton doesn't have many of these skills. Mr. Obama HAS THEM in abundance.
Bill
Abortion IS wrong. The issue is that injecting THE GOVERNMENT into regulating it causes more problems that we already have!!!
The solution that Christians seek is to influence politics & society so that women don't feel they need to make that choice.
Standing on a box screaming that abortion is wrong is easy.
The question is are you willing to do the hard work to touch lives and create choice for people facing that horrible decision?
Or is the solution to lock these women up until they give birth and then send the kids to a broken foster care system to be sodomized?
Do you care?
I thought you just said you were against government regulation.
You're confusing me, Chris. Maybe you'd be more comfortable on a Huckabee board.
Oh, and by the way, the federal government doesn't handle murder. That's a crime at the state level.
I am against government regulation, but I am not an anarchist. Are you an anarchist? Do you think murder should be legalized? What Republican could seriously argue for legalization of Murder?
Also - why are you trying to make someone leave because you don't agree with them? Sounds like a liberal to me.
If you don't think Murder is a crime to the Federal Government... I think you are truly out of touch.
I'm sorry. I guess you couldn't tell. I find your posts to be unbearably illogical and I'm playing with you.
Murder is only a crime at the federal level if a federal employee has been killed; otherwise it's a crime at the state level.
Wow - I agree - that's why i have been responding to your posts.
I haven't read anything close to being logical with anything you have posted on this entire board!
According to what I see in your posts... I should just throw my hands in the air and vote for a Liberal because he tells me that he's a good guy. I should just forget he believes that partial birth abortion should be legal. I should just forget he believes that my money is better spent by the federal government. I should just forget he is the most liberal senator in the US.
I came to this website to find real commentary on why a TRUE conservative or even a Republican would vote for this guy.
I am still looking... and getting depressed by what I see here.
Alright then.
Can a Conservative Republican Really Support Obama?
by Barbara (this is from me, not from RFO)
Well, sure we can. After all, the Republican party is no longer conservative, except perhaps in the social/religious sense. Consider:
Republicans have traditionally been the party of fiscal conservatism, but no more. The only options anymore seem to be "tax and spend" with the Democrats or "spend and spend" with the current Republicans. If those are my two choices, then for the sake of my kids I guess I'll go with the Democrats. Republicans like to pretend like the party promotes tax cuts, but it doesn't, at least not anymore. The current Republicans simply transfer the tax burden to our kids.
The Republicans are no longer in any sense conservative on foreign policy. The approach is bomb now, ask questions later. A true conservative approach would be to maintain a powerful military, but reserve its use for only matters of pressing national interest, after all other options are exhausted.
The Republicans no longer even respect the rights of the individual to be free from government encroachment. The party justifies wiretapping, email interception, seizure of library/phone/credit records in the name of homeland security. Further, the Republicans, the party of "compassionate conservatives" support torture and enhanced interrogation - outright violations of civil liberties and international law.
Originally I had hoped that McCain - with his personal history - would reverse course on several of the issues tied to foreign policy and homeland security. But more and more he's sounding like another Republican warmonger, and more and more he's moving closer to the party line on invasion of privacy, enhanced interrogation, etc.
Okay, so what about Obama?
Whereas Obama is not a conservative, he at least recognizes the need for government to pay for what it buys - he's been pushing pay-go legislation for the Senate for years now. He intends to return to a conservative foreign policy in which we negotiate first, bomb as a last resort. And he believes that the only way America can resume its rightful place as leader of the free world is by denouncing torture and other violations of human liberties.
How does that make me Republican?
I remain a Republican because I believe in the heart and soul of the traditional GOP: that government should be limited at the federal level, that it bears the burden of financially responsible decision making, that it must respect the rights of the common man, that it does not become unnecessarily involved overseas. I remain hopeful that the party will return to its roots, and will free itself from the clutches of the neocon movement. I fear, though, that if the status quo remains much longer, this new incarnation of the Republican Party will *become* the definition of Republicanism. If that were to happen, it would be to the detriment not only of our party, but also of our nation as a whole.
Chris, I've been here over a year and I've had this conversation so many times that I've lost all interest. I just don't have the time to try to explain my position, or the position of RFO, to every horrified individual that wanders by. So there you have my thoughts, FWIW. Hope that helps. I'll let you have the last word because I honestly don't have the energy to belabor this discourse.
Well said as always Bat Girl. Just keep in mind that now that our little orginization is getting more public attention, we will be having lots of republicans coming to take a look, so we may have to go back over our own reasons for supporting Obama while trying to restore our own party to its roots.
Your writing is so well done and is factual, actual and well reasoned, so feel free to keep representing all of us Obamacans.
Thanks, Aaron.
You're not too bad, either. For a Texan. :-D